Ebay bootlegs - (BETA) DVD Talk Forum (2024)

ragtimeacres

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What are everyone's feelings on bootleg movies on Ebay? I'm a classic film collector and there are thousands of movies that the studios have never released and currently Ebay is one of few places to find these movies. I am against bootlegs for movies that are currently in print on VHS or DVD, but if a movie has never been released on home video or it's out of print the studio does not stand to gain from it and they aren't losing anything if individuals make copies and sell them right?

One of my favorite sellers recently got suspended for selling unauthorized copies of classic films that are not available on home video. I've bought dozens of movies from this guy knowing they were collector copies and I'm furious that Ebay suspended him. He was a great source for classic film fans, plus with the amount of inventory he sold Ebay was making some fairly good fees from his auctions. On top of that Ebay has power sellers who sell nothing but collector copies, including some of the same titles he was selling, and they haven't suspended them. I realize Ebay can't be aware of every potentially infringing item listed, but I find it impossible to believe that they can have power sellers who do this and not know what's going on. Why do some sellers get suspended and others go on to make thousands a day for selling the same items? Do they word their auctions in such a way that Ebay doesn't realize the movies are bootlegs? Anybody know what the deal is with this double standard?

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BKenn01

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Yep, and one of these days the studios may sue ebay for facilitating the sales that they allow.

They suspend your friend, but look over the powesellers who are selling them. Before I knew what I was doing and that they where illegal, I bought 3 import dvd. Pure Junk, skipped thru the movie, etc. I say lock them all up.

ShallowHal

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renaldow

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codecomplete

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Not sure why people feel the need to keep posting things like this, as if other people's opinions are going to change their minds since it seems like it's already made up.

You may have standards when it comes to matters like unreleased videos, but that doesn't mean these sellers do. The money that they make will just make them offer even more bootlegs. Yeah, it's buyers like you that keep bootleggers in business.

As for not hurting anyone, well, what about the original rights holder? Perhaps these types of movies will only sell in the thousands, but seeing how readily cheap bootlegs are available, licensors may be reluctant to license something that probably won't sell too many copies and already has been widely available illegally. So, in the end, you and other collectors end up hurting yourselves as well because you guys can't practice restraint.

You're furious that a guy selling illegal products got booted from eBay? I was thinking that perhaps we should be having a party. Yeah, it's only one seller and there are tens of thousands more on eBay and eBay always seem to be dragging their ass, but one seller less at least is a start.

DVD Josh

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That's bullsh*t. eBay makes it very clear that the selling of bootlegs is both against their policy and illegal. They offer a system (VeRO) whereby essentially you don't have do anything but tell eBay it's a boot and they pull the auction.

They do not facilitate. In think eBay does a better job than most when it comes to boots.

cultshock

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It's a tricky subject, but it could actually have the opposite effect too. 10-15 years ago most anime, Hong Kong films, Eurocult films, etc (to use examples of genres I'm interested in) were practically unavailable from legitimate North American companies. It was the heavy interest in the material shown by grey market dealers, tape traders, etc. that made people realize that money could be made in these titles. That lead to smaller companies (eg. Anchor Bay, ADV, etc) taking a chance and actually licencing the rights to some of this material based on the interest seen in the grey market. And I'm sure I was far from the only person who tossed out my bootlegs for better quality legit releases of the same films. And now these genres have become hugely popular and successful, thanks to small companies taking a shot based on such "illegal activity". So, illegal, yes, but in the types of films I'm interested in at least, if it wasn't for dealers like that (and "illegal" trading), I would have never had the opportunity to see and discover such films, and I think in a way, a whole market was created. Just had to put my two cents in about that. (of course I have to admit that this was back in the day before you could easily buy international releases on the net, so "bootlegs" offered the only real alternative. I still stand by what I said though)

Michael Corvin

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I checked into this because I would love to see some of them pulled. For VeRo you have to be the copyright holder or work for the company that holds the rights to the official-original material.

I found a way to report bootlegs but the link is broken.

Mr. Cinema

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maxfisher

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I'm amazed to hear ebay actually suspended someone over bootlegs. I used to consider them a good source for used dvds, but it seems like anytime I run a search anymore, I have to wade through 95% of sh*t-quality bootlegs just to find the 5% of legit auctions that may or may not be worth bidding on. It's such a ridiculous pain in the ass that I rarely will look on ebay for dvds, unless it's something that's enough out of the mainstream that it's not going to attract many bootleggers.

About 6 mos. ago, I got so fed up with wading through bootlegs, I looked into their policy for reporting bad auctions and found the form they have posted. I then picked 5 sellers with monstrous amounts of bootlegs and, every day for a week, reported 10 of each of their auctions that was clearly for an illegal copy. Got little thank you emails from ebay each time. From what I could tell, the sellers were never suspended or forced to take down their illegal auctions. Ebay just sucks at dealing with the problem. I'm usually critical of the movie industry for going too far in 'combating piracy', but I am kind of hoping one or more of the studios sues the sh*t out of ebay to get them to clean up their act.

BKenn01

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You apparantly arent paying much attention then. All anyone has to do is browse thru the listings and you can find listing after listing that clearly gives a tip off that it is a bootleg.

Terms like "Shipped without case", "Region Free", "DVD 9", "DVD 5",
"Coverart may be slightly different from those in stores", "certified Asian import". and on and on.....

I have yet to see a dvd listing from Asia, the Phillipenes or wherever outside the U.S. or Candada that was not selling bootlegs. eBay claims to have these people who troll the auctions to catch them, yea right. And they do not make it easy to turn them in either. You can find many Powersellers who deal with them. eBay apparantley doesnt care, are turning their head or are extremely incompetent.

brainee

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Yes, bootleg DVDs are illegal ... and yes, there are way too many bootleggers on eBay. But I sympathize with the OP, and I'd be lying if I said I never bought a movie that I knew was a bootleg. If there's a movie you want to see, it's not available legit, is kind of obscure ... what are your options? Just wait (maybe years ... maybe forever). Write letter to the studio requesting the release, followed by a form response from them ... and more waiting. I want to see the movie. If a studio releases a good quality DVD at a later, I've often repurchased.

The bootleggers that anger me are the ones who sell stuff that is available legit -- they just sell for much lower prices. It's so bad I just won't buy any commercially available DVDs through eBay (which is too bad for the legit businesses). BKenn01 has some good tips -- but you can still get burned. I can't for the life of me figure out how these sellers get such great feedback scores (unless the buyer population is a lot stupider than I thought). The quality is usually crap too.

codecomplete

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As you say, that was back in the day. The market and marketplace has changed. So is what you said still revelant today? Not much relevance is it? Yeah, not everything has been licensed or released, but the marketplace is more global now so that if you can't find a certain title here in the U.S., it may be available legally elsewhere in the world. And with such a global market in mind, titles that weren't feasible are more than likely to be licensed and released and we don't have to wait until Hell freezes over anymore. Does this mean that everything under the sun will come out eventually? No, I'm sure that there are many obscure titles that will never see the legal light of day, but who knows, Hell may actually freeze over one day.

I do agree with you that a lot of legit companies were started by hobbyists who traded/bought/sold their favorite videos back then, but that's nothing compared to the bootleg market today. There were not a whole lot of options back then. Can you say that now?

So what is it that you're standing by? That you're OK with the "grey" market and that there are bootleggers on eBay? Well, good for you and those like you. Like I said, I'm not sure why people keep making these posts as if other people's opinions are going to change their minds. I still think that the best way to get more legal releases is to support legal companies even if it means waiting a long time or even never seeing an obscure title that I want to see. Supporting a bootlegger is not like being unhappy with Walmart so you do your shopping at BestBuy. Give money to a bootlegger and all you're going to get is more bootlegs.

codecomplete

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Maybe we should make stickum post where we have a list of good bootleggers and bad bootleggers.

ShallowHal

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Where'd you read that eBay claims to have employees that actually search for bootlegs? I don't know how you can "troll" auctions, btw.

Actually, it's very easy to report an illegal bootleg. Click 'Help', search "report bootleg", click "Bootleg Recordings", click "Report" at the bottom. I do it a few times a month when I find obvious boots.

Someone is selling quite a few copies of the Super Bowl on craigslist, I'm tempted to buy one and turn them in to the NFL, but I'd rather watch a movie.

Yeah, let's get together and help each other break the law.

BKenn01

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I am basing that off the MSNBC doc. Ebay claims to have employees whos job it is to monitor fraud in listings.

Yes, please excuse my grammer. I is a victim of publik edumucation

cultshock

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Ooookay. I admitted that the market is different now. I was just stating that I don't have a problem with the type of bootleggers that the OP mentioned because of my past experiences. If it wasn't for grey market dealers selling that stuff when the market was different from today, and creating interest in new types of genres, you wouldn't see all the different niche genre stuff being legitimately released today. It would be all mainstream crap like it used to be, and for THAT, I'm very thankful.

At any rate, you're not entirely correct anyway regarding relevence today. What about fansubbed stuff? Sure, certain titles may be found elsewhere in the world now, but they won't always have English subs. And I'll admit that I purchase or trade fan subbed boots now and then, because even today, it's still often the only way to get English translated versions of material I'm interested in. So, yeah, I am OK with the "grey" market (that part of it). Sorry, but I don't feel guilty for owning such discs. Anyway, I don't want to derail the thread or anything, so I'm done with the subject, I've stated my opinion.

codecomplete

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To feel guilty, wouldn't you need a conscience? You say that I can't make you feel guilty so I'm not sure why you think that I was trying to since I wasn't. As I've said, other people's opinions are not going to change anyone's mind since it's already made up.

It's funny, you talk about the grey market back in the day, but you seem to forget that it was a fan culture type of thing where profit wasn't part of the deal because once you cross that line, it becomes something else. I guess we all have selective memory.

Edit. If I've offended you, it wasn't my intention. I usually try to restrain myself and not post as much as I used to, but when I see a thread like this, someone bemoaning the loss of a bootlegger, it's hard to pass up. This site promotes legit products and companies and a post like this is an insult to everyone here. I don't have a problem with people buying bootlegs, it's their money and their choice, just don't try to justify it or promote it where it's not wanted.

Last edited by codecomplete; 02-08-06 at 04:23 AM.

Billyspunk

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dvd_luver

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Bootlegging is just wrong, but there are some sellers on ebay providing obvious bootlegs of rare not released entertainment, and telling you they aren't official items. So does that make it ok? At the very least they aren't screwing you by making you think your getting something authentic and a getting a genuine retail product.

Than you have ones that make it obvious (if you know it hasn't been released yet) and go by that.

So, is it ok for them to tell you it's pirated, or it's of their own doing (VHS to DVD, etc), and let you know your getting something fake?

What can ebay or the MPAA do than to them, if you know?

Ebay will probably remove these items ASAP if reported.

onitapgr

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Does anyone know if these are bootlegs or legit?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Alfred-Hitchco*ck...QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Stanley-Kubrick-...QQcmdZViewItem

There are a bunch of sets like these on ebay....I was wondering how the quality is on them and if they are worth it.

X

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Is this just a coincidence?

http://contact.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI...ted=movie_swap

onitapgr

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Explain please? Who is movie swap?

Chrisedge

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Read the member names here, and read who was the ebay username from Sep-19-99 through Mar-22-03